After I on 1. May got the message that my GE+P65 accounts were
reopened, I thought my troubles were over. They were not!
I requested a withdrawal of $5000 (max withdrawal amount) on 7. May
from my P65 account - no problems - the money came to me.
On 23. May I requested a withdrawal of €3500 from my GammonEmpire
account, koule11 - and now I come into a deja vu situation: The
withdrawal was rejected without reason. When I contacted GE-support
for this, I got this chat:

Danny: our tech team has found some irregularities in your account
Danny: we need you to send us game files
koule11: eh
Danny: the game numbers are: 21415755, 21349548, 21314504, 21239920,
and 21239598
koule11: i was asked this earlier - i send game files - the account
was reopened - and now i requested a withdrawal again
Danny: do you know where to find the game files?
koule11: i have deleted all log files
koule11: why i have to send 5 old log files ? - what this has to do
with my withdrawal request ?
Danny: we need to investigate these games
koule11: ok - you can investigate them - but i dont have them - do you
have them ?
Danny: we have them in our archives, but it would be much faster if
you send them yourself
koule11: oh ok- but i dont have them - as i didnt play for long time
Danny: one moment please
koule11: ah wait - i have the files
Danny: you do?
koule11: i was asked to send these files earlier - and i did - after
my account was reopened
koule11: and now i requested a withdrawal - i didnt play at all since
Danny: I'm sorry , but this is our management's request
Danny: I can't change it
koule11: ok - if i send the files now - when my withdrawal will be
approved ?
Danny: it will take a couple of days or so to examine the games and
come to a result
Danny: we will notify you via e-mail as soon as we have a decision
koule11: ok ill send the 5 files now, and after I will wait my
withdrawal to be approved
Danny: thank you for your cooperation. our address is:
support@skillempire.com


Now these 5 files were among the 9 files i was asked to send 2 months
ago. Now i have to send them again. lol

Btw. the Snowie error rate of these 5 moneygames is 6.5

I dont think this is a good way to treat customers, and I'm wondering
how long time this will go on - probably is not the last time I have
to send these 5 famous log files.

/Erik Sorensen

That's total bullshit. "We have the files but it will be
faster if you send them?" They either have all their own
logs and can do a fine job of examining them on their own
(as I suspect is the case, which makes them BS artists), or
they don't. If they don't, they're incompetent.

-Patti
--
Patti Beadles, Oakland, CA |
pattib~pattib.org | All religions are equally
http://www.pattib.org/ | ludicrous, and should be ridiculed
www.urbanscapephoto.com | as often as possible. C. Bond

On 28 Mai, 16:58, pat...@green.rahul.net (Patti Beadles) wrote:
> That's total bullshit. "We have the files but it will be
> faster if you send them?" They either have all their own
> logs and can do a fine job of examining them on their own
> (as I suspect is the case, which makes them BS artists), or
> they don't. If they don't, they're incompetent.
>
> -Patti
> --
> Patti Beadles, Oakland, CA |
> pattib~pattib.org | All religions are equally
> http://www.pattib.org/| ludicrous, and should be ridiculed
> www.urbanscapephoto.com| as often as possible. C. Bond

I followed these GE/play65 - discussions a long time now.
1.They dont have the files at all.I know that from a previous
dispute.They just have the gamedata(time and opponent), but no
snowiefiles.
2.They do this kind of hassle with most players who want to
withdraw.Many didnt save files at all or dont even have an idea how to
fight for the funds.In a few cases they pay to bait the sharks to keep
action alive.I dont believe that,i KNOW that,cause i know many of the
cheated players.Its not my proplem anymore cause i stopped playing
there,just a waring for all you here.
The calculation in Erics case is very simple.He (nearly) stopped
playing,so its much better to loose him as a player(and one of the
winning species they especially dont like)as to pay him a couple of
thousands.
And it works:I my case noone here seems to be bothered that money is
stolen.All the sharks hope they will get through with their
winnings.Some will be paid,and most continue playing.
ty

1. P65/GE don't explain what they mean by "irregularities"
2. P65/GE start talking about those "irregularities" after the reject
the withdrawal, not before.
3. P65/GE obviuosly has no working tracking or trouble ticket system.
4. They are suspecting someone for the second time without any
additional information
5. They are obvioulsy not keeping or archiving the correspondence from
the earlier case.
6. Not getting important data out of an archive quickly is highly
unprofessional for a company of this size.

==> P65/GE is starting to convert their own problems into customers
problems. A strategy which already other companies used in the past.
Well, it may help them short-term. Long-term they are dead.

I thought they learned by the last case. Probably not.

Ciao

acepoint

> I thought they learned by the last case. Probably not.


How about "they DID learn from many previous cases"
They learned, confiscating money without reason will succeed in a
given amount of cases
They learned, even the lamest excuse is good enough to stall the case
for a while and will succeed in a given amount of additional cases
They learned, there are a few players who will fight for their rights
and they learned, from where on lame excuses don´t work anymore, in
this case they will in the end pay out, in all other cases they get
away with it

Can you guess?
Unless they strongly believe in absolute fairness, any halfway smart
(or should I say ruthless?) business man who figures out such an
opportinity for extra profit, wouldn´t think twice what to do

Can you guess?
They don´t even intend to examine anything at all, they are simply
delaying the payout, any lame excuse is good enough, knowing that the
longer they delay it the more players will give up, which has two
positive effects for the company
1) getting rid of an unwanted winner
2) making additional profit above rake

Has any of you sharks ever considered the possibility that not only GE
but basically no company at all wants you to play on their server?
They are HAPPY if you leave, they only can not admit it, because it
would scare away too many others who hope for a win

Have you been in a real casino? Are you aware what casinos do with
gamblers who manage permanent winnings? They ban them from playing!
Occasional winnings are allowed, even big ones, they are used as an
advertising for the company, but in the long run ONLY players who
permanently BRING money are welcome

You sharks see 1000s of games you played, you calculate how much rake
you paid for that, but you ignore the fact, you actually didn´t pay a
dime, you MADE money, your opponents paid the bill, and the server has
to share their profit with you
I can only suggest, you have to be realistic, you have to see the real
facts as the companies see them, be grateful if you find a server
willing to share their profit, but you should always keep in mind,
from the servers point of view YOU are stealing THEIR profit, without
you the fish would keep playing one another until the rake has eaten
up everyones money

On 28 May 2007 07:25:08 -0700, ems@get2net.dk wrote:

> On 23. May I requested a withdrawal of ¤3500 from my GammonEmpire
> account, koule11 - and now I come into a deja vu situation: The
> withdrawal was rejected without reason.

Would one be likely to encounter similar problems if the company were
located in a legally more accessible country (i.e. another EU country?) Or
would this offer more protection and safety? What you and other people
describe seems barely legal regardless of what their terms say.

M.

> you should always keep in mind,
> from the servers point of view YOU are stealing THEIR profit, without
> you the fish would keep playing one another until the rake has eaten
> up everyones money

Thank you Piranha, for me this has been the more insightful comment on
this sad story. The way GE handled the situation, their goal could
have been only to drive the best players away from their site, and it
looks like their have succeeded beyond any hope in doing so. All they
want is more fish.

As for the sites who make robots play, this generates *a lot* more
profit than occasionally stealing some winnings, and it is no wonder
that they appear much more friendly and professional !